Looney Labs Fluxx Mailing list Archive

Re: [Fluxx] Must draw first?

  • FromJoseph Pate <jpate@xxxxxxxxxxx>
  • DateFri, 5 Oct 2007 18:59:56 -0700 (PDT)
Hi James:

I think I disagree -- but the reason I'm not sure is that I don't have the
exact text of the Basic Rules (which might differ among versions) in front
of me to refer to, and a quick Google search turned up nothing.

Request to WebRabbits (i.e. Rabbits who love to put stuff on the web):
can anyone enhance the card list to include the actual text verbatim 
for every card, including the basic rules?  It would help low-quality
Rabbits like myself  ;-)  who fail to bring their Fluxx deck(s) with
them wherever they go.

That way, these sorts of rules-based discussions would be easier for rules
lawyers like me  ;-)

I know, I know, I should just do it myself -- but the last thing I put on
the web was a personal page that is so outdated it doesn't even mention
my wife or son.

If I remember the text correctly, it says Draw 1 *and* Play 1, not Draw 1
*then* Play 1.  Another way to look at this [if you agree with my 
perspective] is:

"A turn in Fluxx consists of the following actions in any order:

Draw a number of cards according to the current Draw rule
Play a number of cards according to the current Play rule 
Discard played keepers down to the current Keeper Limit, if applicable
Discard held [hand] cards down to the current Hand Limit, if applicable
If any cards in play contradict these actions, such cards take precedence

(e.g. Draw 2 & Use 'Em, wherein it specifically says that whatever you 
do during that "subturn" counts as 1 play and 0 draws in the tally of your
"regular" turn)

Did I make sense here?  To summarize:  I agree with James' reference to 
the word 'may' in the Limit cards, but feel that the lack of an ordering
term on the basic rules means draws need not precede plays -- even though
there's no such 'may' on the basic rules.


[James said...]

I think I can discredit Andy's Hand Limit video from being used as evidence.
(It sounds like I've been playing too much Phoenix Wright.)

It could be that, in normal cases, the Hand & Keeper Limits must wait until
the end of the turn, and you can't opt to discard early. However, since the
Hand Limit card states that you may discard before the end of your turn,
this is allowing the players to break the normal rule laid out in the rule
sheet. It just so happens that ever Limit functions this way, so we do not
think of it as a special non-core rule, even though it is.

To put it another way--I don't know if the last paragraph made any
sense--the only reason Hand & Keeper Limits work that way is because the
card text states that in these specific cases, you may do things out of
turn. Since Draw and Play rules don't have this "may" text, it would be
improper to assume that they fall under this mechanic as well.

In summary, it is the text on the card that causes the option with Hand &
Keeper Limits. Since Draw & Play rules don't have this text, they are not
ambiguous and must return to the core rules as laid out in the rule sheet
(Draw before Play).

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