Looney Labs Icehouse Mailing list Archive

Re: [Icehouse] Re: Single-Stash Games Designers Wanted

  • From"Avri Klemer" <avri@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • DateMon, 2 Apr 2007 17:01:16 -0400
I *love* this idea, David.

You've kicked my butt into gear to finally fine tune/playtest my game design (for single Treehouse set and chessboard, without die) called Penguin Soccer. When do you need finished games "published" to the Wiki by? I have a hard time working without a deadline, apparently.....


----- Original Message ----- From: "David Artman" <david@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: "Icehouse List" <icehouse@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 4:55 PM
Subject: [Icehouse] Re: Single-Stash Games Designers Wanted

Thanks, everyone, for your replies and interest in this project. I will
address the points in the order I see them:

Regarding the single stash (SS) versus Treehouse set (TH) Categories, I
am going to propose the following guidelines, which I will add to the
Category pages' descriptions, if everyone agrees:
* If the game uses no more than 15 pieces and color is irrelevant, it's
"single stash."
* If the game uses no more than 15 pieces and color is relevant or is
used to distinguish piece ownership during play, it's "Treehouse set."
* A game is tagged as both ONLY IF it has variants that allow for the
use of either a SS or TH.

An example of the latter is Ikkozendo or Armada, both of which need no
more than 15 pieces but have variants that could make color
(ir)relevant. Ikkozendo can be played in a limited fashion with a
monochrome stash; Armada can require a single monochrome stash per
player, if multiplayer or allowing folks to select their fleets.

Work for everyone? If so, please tag your games with the appropriate
Category or Categories, if it has variants that qualify it as both:
[[Category:Single stash]]
[[Category:Treehouse set]]

If you disagree, please suggest alternate definitions--but see below for
my opinion on the relevance of the TH die.

I will check both Categories to put together the compilation; and I will
not republish games that were printed in other Looney Labs publications
(per agreement with Josh).

There is no "Treehouse games" category, and I do not think folks are
using [[Category:Treehouse set]] to denote that the die is used--the
use (or not) of a die is trivial and largely irrelevant: all TH sets
come with a die; or you can simulate a TH die with a d6.

Yes, if this is released under CC license, it can't be sold by us or by
Looney Labs. BUT, the decision to release as CC was made after the
print-on-demand option was considered and rejected.

And, no, we couldn't use games already under CC license in the book, if
the book *was* to be released by us as POD. As so many of the wiki's
games are already under CC, the games actually available to use in an
intended-for-sale book would be quite limited anyway. And, frankly, I
don't want the hassle of PayPaling 50¢ to every designer for each sale
(or whatever it would work out to be in the end).

Hence the term "loss leader." We lose ability to earn income from games
in this book in exchange for (hopefully) promoting the game system we
all love. And maybe an extra Carrot or two! ;)

Hmmm... and while I'm on the subject, it occurs to me that an individual
designer (or team) *can* compile their rights-reserved (i.e. not CC or
open) games into a book and attempt to sell it. I do not think a patent
on Icehouse pieces or the Treehouse set prevents original derivative
works that *use* said pieces from being sellable. Perhaps someone at LL
knows for sure how this works out and will inform us at to what rights
they hold and what activities involving Icehouse pieces would raise
their legal ire?

Finally, I do consider a game that uses Martian Coasters as qualifying
for the book (you're in, Chris--I *love* Zamboni Wars!). Of course, if
EVERY game in the book required MCs, then I would re-subtitle it. But
if only, like, three end up requiring them, then I won't. Basically,
look at Playing With Pyramids for a general idea of how I will break
down sections in the book--I intend to do categories like "Boardless or
Abstract", "On a Chessboard," and "On Martian Coasters." Yes, this
should help drive MC sales as well, but the book won't  totally REQUIRE

If someone has a better suggestion for how to subdivide the book (once
all are appropriately Categorized on the wiki), I'm all ears (like a
good rabbit should be).

I think that covers all list postings thus far.

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